The Mission After

Mike Bledsoe (00:00)
Welcome to the mission after podcast, where we help veterans discover and execute on the most important mission of their lives. I'm your host, Mike Bledsoe. Our guest today is Sunshine Grace, born in Sheridan, Montana and raised in Portland, Oregon and Mesa, Arizona. Sunshine's early connection to nature and community initiatives on universal love and compassion deeply influenced her. At age 22, she joined the military for housing and educational opportunities, where she learned the true meaning of first in, last out leadership.

Sunshine earned her master's degree in research psychology and worked for a large corporation for 12 years in Jacksonville, Florida, where she also helped raise her stepdaughter. This period became her first haven for safety and belongingness, but she also became aware of her family's history of anxiety and depression.

After a profound experience in Kenya, she moved to Austin in 2018 and began her emotional healing journey. In 2019, her health mandated an early retirement leading to a four year period of severe mental health breakdowns. Sunshine's healing journey included a transformative relationship with Ayahuasca beginning in 2022, which she attributes along with the unconditional love and support from her friends and family to her recovery.

Today, Sunshine is passionate about meditation, non -duality, redemptive love, and the reverent use of psychedelics among other interests. By the end of this episode, you'll discover three major takeaways. One, the transformative impact of ayahuasca and other sacred medicines on healing and developing awareness. Two, insights into psycho -emotional roots of disease and the importance of integration in mindfulness practices. Three,

the journey of creating safety and self -discovery and the challenges of transitioning from military to civilian life. But before we dive in, I want to tell you all about the new resource we have at themissionafter .org. It's called the 10 Surprising Military Habits That Are Sabotaging Your Career and Your Life. This guide will help you identify and overcome those habits, so be sure to download it at themissionafter .org. Now let's get to the conversation with Sunshine Grace.

Mike Bledsoe (02:06)
Well, sunshine, it's good to be here with you today. And a friend, a mutual friend introduced us a while back on social media. And one of the things that really caught my attention was, you know, I'm like quickly in the DMs going back and forth with people and then it's like voice note. And then your voice comes across and I'm like, she has a really nice voice. She just speaks so softly and calmly and.

not not what I was expected from the introduction because it was like, she's a veteran, too. And she is doing this work. And I was expecting a little more like like quick and fast, which is usually what I'm dealing with. And then it was it was like you forced me to slow down. And and that's nice. I like that. What? Were you always that slow?

Like, it's a compliment. Thanks, Mike. First, I'll just say thanks for the opportunity to speak with you today. And yeah, I could just tell energetically when we were first introduced that. And I guess on here, you can say whatever you want that you're the kind of person that gets shit done. You're very action oriented, but you're also reflective and.

I knew I could connect with the reflection part of you and I appreciate being military to get shit done part of you. So yeah, thanks for, thanks for this opportunity. I have not always been slow. I started slowing down. Yeah. When I started working with ayahuasca two years ago, but before that I was very unconscious, very connected from my body.

very disconnected from the energy I was creating and affecting others with. Yeah, when you say unconscious, can I imagine people are listening and going, well, I don't know, of course I'm conscious, I'm awake.

What would you how would you how would you describe that? Wow, that's a great question. I'm glad you asked that. I think about this a lot, too, because I think there are a lot of frameworks that we can use to talk about what essentially maybe is like the most comfortable go to framework, which is more sciencey and sciencey framework would describe maybe as altered states.

And by unconscious, I mean, I was letting the content of my thoughts, derive my nervous system and my actions. Instead of

developing awareness so that I could be more of the container of my thoughts and fully present and listen so I could decide from there what to do. Very different. Yeah. And before that you were much more in reaction. Would you say? Six years panicking.

How many years 46 years 46 years in panic? Yeah, I mean the average American you interact with their rate of speech Which is a function of their rate of breath, which is a function of their heart rate is Very unconscious. It's just being driven by high anxiety

Yeah, there's a, I mean, the amount of people on psychiatric drugs in the country right now is staggering. I, a lot of times I'll start working with a veteran, they'll come in and we'll get to a point in the conversation of, well, you know, I'm fine. I'm totally fine. Things are going good. And I'm like, well, I don't know, you know, why are you here?

And then it was like, well, if I come off my drugs, I'm not fine. And I'm afraid to come off of my drugs.

Yeah. Yeah. Did you have any experiences with psychiatric drugs like big pharma drugs or anything like that and trying to cope with the anxiety?

no, and I have no judgment towards those who have, I have so much compassion, so much compassion for anxiety and depression. I drank the Kool -Aid from the mainstream messaging around like shaming pharmaceuticals when we need help. And so I never considered it.

And now I have a very different view. I think people are doing whatever they can do to not suffer and no judgment for me, but now I just push through it all. Yeah. So where do you, where do you think the cause of the suffering came from?

that's a big, beautiful question. Do you mean in general for people or for me personally? For you personally? Yeah. You know, I'd like to choose frameworks for understanding things. And for this question, the framework that feels most comfortable for me is actually the one that the Shippibo

and the other 23, I think, total tribes in the Amazon use, which is that all disease, or the majority of disease, is psycho -emotional. It has a psycho -emotional root. And so, and then I'm not saying that as a speculation for myself, I know personally that for me,

that anxiety and depression were directly related to trauma, really, just trauma. And it's so insane to me to think about how I or anyone else could go through most of their life or their entire life, like a fish in water, and not even knowing.

that they are living in an anxious and depressed state their entire life.

and that there's another way to be in the world. Another way to relate to our emotions to our body to to our relationships. It's just wild. It's just wild. I feel like in in 2022, when I did sit with Ayahuasca, I mean, that has been a very challenging path. But also,

extremely beneficial because I jumped out of the water. I jumped out of the water of our mainstream culture. I jumped out of, I got some space between my trauma and me. And I now a year and nine months into this journey and I'm a late bloomer with psychedelics.

Well, you can just, as you mentioned at the beginning of this conversation, my, I'm just calmer. I'm just more at peace. You know, as, as the, I mean, I say that in, in a lot of shamanic cultures, they're very showy and they do a lot of stuff on the outside. And then in the far East, they're very internal and they bring that altar inside. And that really sums up what's.

been happening to me emotionally, psychologically, spiritually for the last almost two years, the altars coming inside and learning how.

to be in harmony with everything. Yeah. Yeah.

And did you seek anything out prior to ayahuasca? So there'll be a this is a two part question. Did you seek out anything before ayahuasca to try? You know, how did you know that to look for anything? And then what was the moment that you realized that you were called to that particular medicine?

Hmm. Did I seek it out? Well, I think a lot of people can relate to having like a pull or a curiosity towards plant medicines or psychedelics. And I had been working with psilocybin mushrooms for a couple of years before I got curious about actually doing ayahuasca. But when I decided to go down and sit,

it was a very strong pole. Like I could physically feel like a, like a pole in my gut down there. And I remember, I think I waited five months between registration and flying down and it was like, the time's going so slow. I can't wait. And I had no idea what I was going to experience. I just, are you laughing? Cause you can relate. Yes. yeah. Just thinking of the,

There's a common phrase of the ceremony starts or the medicine starts working once you sign up or once you once you make the choice to go and to have five months for that medicine to start percolating. My fiance actually was doing ayahuasca this past weekend. She was in ceremony and she had about two months.

And, and, yeah, I've sat with ayahuasca quite a bit and I'm familiar with the process. And as it got closer, just more and more things started bubbling up and I got to, because I'm aware of how, how this medicine tends to work or just, just be with whatever's coming up. And when you get in there, you'll see why everything leading up to that point.

was the way it was.

Absolutely. And, and do you think she would say now that she's come out of ceremony, she understands? Yes. Yes. She called me yesterday and debriefed me and it was, she had a beautiful experience and yes, it was everything leading up to it. She goes, okay, I got it now. She's lucky to have you give her some guidance and be on the other side of that tunnel to start integration.

She's fortunate. That's I think that's really key for post ceremony is to have some people. So did you have that experience of being able to plug into a community? man, no. But my like my first my first so I've sat now with the medicine four times. It was June of 2022.

14 months later, September of 2023, three months later, December of last year, and then two weekends ago.

The reason why it was 14 months.

and was between the first and second time is because that was when I started having so many mystical experiences. And so maybe to answer your second question, like did I decide or did the plant, what it felt like from the start until a few months ago, really. Well, heck, I was in Jordan a month ago.

And it was, I was flying back on the, I was in my layover in the airport in Istanbul, Turkey, and I had taken a smaller dose of gummy for cannabis with knowing that I wanted to do a journey on the way back because it was a 13 hour flight. And I think, okay, no responsibilities for 13 hours. Perfect. Right. it wasn't until last month.

that I actually completely ground from a year and almost nine months of mystical experiences that continue today, but I couldn't ground because they were so outside of the box, so outside of the box. So, no, I knew I wanted to sit with Ayahuasca, but from the very start, it was very clear that anybody with

tons of courage would have felt like they were a victim. It was like, it was not a choice. Yeah. When you say mystical experiences, what,

Can you give an example of a mystical experience? Then we can assume there's people in the audience who hear mystical experience. And I know this because when people come to a program, a lot of times one of the questions can be, have you had a mystical experience? And most people check no. that's great. It's great that you have that as an input question. That's a lot of value in that.

mystical experiences. Yeah. From the get go that week, I was having telepathic conversations with the Shippibo healers and verified through like through conversations with my mind with them.

verified that they were happening when we were sober.

I mean, at one point, and I did mention this actually on a podcast I did interview, I did back on January 1st through the mindful impact podcast that. That at one point I asked, cause it was a husband and wife team, very well respected down in the Amazon maestro, America and Maestro Olga, 27 years of experience, I think collectively. I know them. Do you.

I've sat with them a couple times. Yes. Yeah. Through Temple of the Way of the Light or Soltera? Soltera. Okay. Awesome. Okay, perfect. I'm glad you know them. So that first, we drank four times that week. The first time the medicine tasted like grape juice to me.

And yeah, if I would, now I know, my God, I'm in for it. You know, that's like, that's something's coming. And Olga and I talked the whole time while she was singing to me. And before ceremony started, I was speaking with Maestro Amerigo when he was across the Maloka. I had a conversation with him and asked him to slow down and give me time to sleep.

And so he was guiding me on how to do that through our minds. And Olga saying to me, we had a full on, I mean, she was telling me things from my past. And Mariko got in front of me and it was just Kachua, Igros. And I couldn't translate to English. And the second time we drank, I think it was the next night, I thought,

I really want to get on his station. Like there's something, there's like, he's a super high frequency when he's in that trance state. He's a super high frequency, very powerful. And so I drank the second night and there was like almost no effect. I could still communicate with her, but it was a very light night. And I thought after that, what did I do right to the first time? Let me do some trial and error. And I thought, well, the first time I,

fasted before ceremony. Maybe I can fast again. So I fasted before the third night drank. And when he sang to me, I could, we could, we could communicate. And it was, it was awe inspiring, but it was actually very triggering because it felt really lonely that I was having, I mean, that was, that's just one sample example. There are many things that happened that week that

My experiences were an outlier compared to the others too. So, but coming back to Austin, other mystical experiences included me trying to find an ayahuasca community here in Austin that I resonated with and I couldn't find anyone. So I was reading a famous book called Plant Spirit Medicine.

And the author, who's a well -respected medicine man, said, you can ask the spirit of one plant to embody the spirit of another plant. And I thought, well, am I crazy or stupid? Should I just not do this? But then whenever I'm in a risky situation, I'm like, screw it. I'm just going to do it. So I set up ceremony with psilocybin mushrooms, a very high dose, and asked the spirit of ayahuasca to become.

the spirit of sell seven mushrooms and it worked. And from that point on, that was August of 2022. I had out of body experiences. I started communicating with a voice that I called spirit today. Just tell people I don't identify as a medium necessarily, but it's just think of it as like a mediumship and started hearing whistling.

outside my head in my bedroom. They were Icaros waking me up in the morning. I mean, it was just experience after experience. Teaching dreams started then. So I get taught in my dreams by the presence I call spirit, mostly on universal love and compassion that started. I started getting...

It's hard to explain, but you know, I'm sure you know alpha and beta brainwave state are the productive brainwave states. The theta is the lucid state and then the delta and gamma are sleep and deep sleep. So in theta, it's when we're falling asleep, it's in the hypnopopic, I believe. And when we're waking up is hypnagogic, but it's the same lucid state. And that is also the state that we enter if we can self -hypnotize or somebody can hypnotize us. It's also the trance state that the shamans go into.

anytime I'm in a theta state, starting last August, two years ago, I hear people's conversations in the collective. And they're just snippets. Sometimes I get visions, like, but it's rarely anything anyone I know, sometimes it's someone I know. And it's really useful information. And I thought,

for a long time, like, am I supposed to be a medium and help people? And I was really confused. And when I went to Peru in September, the conversation was in Spanish. So I was picking up the local and when I went to Jordan, it was in Arabic. And I asked Spirit, actually in ceremony, what's happening there? And Spirit said, you're like, you're very sensitive now and you're like a radio Montana.

and you just pick up information from the collective and does it bother you? And I said, no, it's kind of nice because you never really feel alone. I mean, you're always hearing people, you know. Mm hmm. Yeah, they. So when when they all mentioned the audience is a lot of times. I was very different than most psychedelics, so very.

I tell people it is psychedelic, but it's more than a psychedelic. And so it doesn't quite give it justice if you're referring to it as like, there's just one of those other psychedelics. And one of the really common things that I've seen happen over and over again is there are most people don't have this experience, but some do. And that is gifts are awakened. You're you're awakened to some gifts.

sensitivities increase and that gift was my opinion is the gift was always there and the sensitivity wasn't there yet because you know, we've got so much baggage laid on top or for me, it was a belief that I needed to be tough and in order to be tough, I couldn't be sensitive. And so, I imagine that's true for a lot.

I know that's true for a lot of veterans and my interactions with them is like, yeah, just stuff everything down. I'm not being in contact with the feeling world. When I'm in contact with the feeling world and I can have that experience, all of a sudden I am having a totally different experience of reality. And if we're not in touch with the feeling world, if we're not in touch with these other gifts, then...

we're getting a very small snippet of reality. And when it opens up, I think it's open for so few people to the degree in which it is for you that some people it's, it's so outside of what they think could be real. They, they could, they could just easily dismiss it. And so, and I've seen this happen over and over and over again with people who go into the medicine space,

The gifts are not always the same. It's not like everyone gets the same gift. I remember when I came back from my first round of ayahuasca is I was able to sense other people's fear.

Is like I knew when somebody was afraid which was almost all the time for for most people. So I'd interact with somebody. they're just afraid. Somebody was like, they're they don't seem like they're a very nice person or they're not this or that or something. There's some type of judgment about them. I go, well, they're just really afraid. And and so it's. It was more of a.

not so much I could feel it, it was just I knew it. It's like all of a sudden the patterns of fear behavior just triggered in my subconscious and I go, okay, that's what fear is. Cool. Got it. So, and a big part of that is I had to deal with a lot of my own fear. I was always afraid. And so because I worked through that, then it made it, then I became like the expert on it in a way.

Yeah. Wow, what a blessing. Yeah, this medicine definitely blesses us up when, when we go down and sit with it. You know, down down in South America for the listeners, they call it cleaning. It's like the shaman's medicines cleaning out the trash, which is, you know, as you said really well, it's like it's it's

Probably the Hindus do the best job of describing this. It's like we have life happening before us. And in the present moment, we see something beautiful like a sunset.

And the sunset sets, the sun sets, and we still want to hold on and cherish that moment. So with that attachment, that's an attachment. And, or we have, we see a snake, say the snake bites a little boy, and we close our aperture, we close our, our hearts and minds, we resist that experience. That also makes a mental impression. I'm saying mental impression, but you could just call it a memory, right?

And these memories over time is what we say we are and who we are. And the word in Hinduism is samskara. And the process of spiritual awakening through mindfulness practices like meditation in the Far East is you're witnessing all of these impressions, which is, I'll just say,

In the West, we'd say traumas arise and learning to witness, learning not to resist anything, learning not to grasp at anything, breathe through it, use different techniques to sit with it. And then eventually we get so familiar with our minds.

that we don't have to, we're not even interested in those impressions anymore. We're like, it's the same old thing. Or you might've been, fear for me would be worried about social approval, right? Comes from trauma from feeling like an outsider as a kid. And after a while you're like, it's that same old thing. And so you learn to come back to the present moment. And that is,

what's called the purification process in many wisdom traditions. It's bringing us back to the present, back to the present, back to the present. These plants do that. They bring it all up so it can get cleaned, right? And I love that you shared some of your gifts. I'm curious to know how long that sensitivity to other people's fear lasted for you.

I would say it hasn't really diminished. It's more of I got used to just that being the status quo. So for several months afterwards, it was, my gosh, my gosh, my gosh, to where it's like, I just now know that it doesn't set the alarm bell off like it used to because it's become so normal.

Nice. Do you consider it a gift now? yes. Yes. I mean, I'm working with people. I'm coaching people. It's allowed me to be able to create safety and security for others. Because I can I know I know as soon as they don't feel safe and what to do about it. Wow. Okay, so I'm curious, Mike, what do you do? How do you help people feel safe?

It really depends on the situation. It's super, it's very intuitive in the moment. Can you give an example?

yeah, when, when I,

When I'm in a conversation with somebody, I want to create safety. A lot of times I can tell that they're experiencing an edge. Something feels like an edge for them. And so then I'll share something about myself that's similar to the edge they're experiencing. And that gives them permission to to talk about that. There's also been instances where I've been in the medicine space with people.

and they are on an edge there and being able to...

communicate to them effectively that they're completely safe and secure and whatever it is they're experiencing in this moment. And I, in fact, I really see a lot of value in writing the line of, I think I'm not okay to, I'm feeling safe and teetering on that line and, and

allowing them to expand themselves into a greater sense of safety in those experiences. So I see it a lot as similar to, you know, I come from a fitness background. It's like, okay, I know how to make the body stronger. And that means it needs to be, you need to have a progressive overload. You actually have to overload the system a little bit.

just a tiny bit. You don't want to overload it too much, but just a tiny bit and then it gets stronger. And so, when I think about like emotional states, it's the same way is we're going to push the emotional boundary a little bit to where you almost don't feel safe. You can feel the fear coming up and then we can back off and then we can push back into it a little bit and then come back in. And so,

whether that's in a medicine space or whether that's simply in a coaching session where we're having a conversation. That's how I like to play. Wow, those are beautiful illustrations. And it makes me so happy to hear about your work with veterans and how you're using your intuition to help them feel safe and not alone, really. And I feel really grateful to you for the work you're doing.

Thank you. I've got a, on the veteran note, can you share a little bit about what your experience of leaving the military was like?

Do you want to know up until I left or after?

whatever you feel is, one of the, one of the things I'd love to know is, is like the moment that you, decided that you were going to get out because sometimes that could be, you know, someone's been in for six months and they're like, wow, this is not for me. I'm going to wait out my contract. or it could be, I didn't know until a week before my contract was up, I was going to get out and there,

I love to hear about what caused the choice to leave. Because I'm somebody and I know a lot of people that they did not.

their mind actually changed at some point. It was like, I'm gonna do 20 years. It's like, no, I'm actually gonna do five. And so, yeah, what was that point? And then what was, I also like to know what happened in that time from choosing to leave to actually getting out.

thank you for asking. It's also nice to be able to talk about this topic because I don't, I don't really talk about this to anyone anymore. And it feels like another lifetime ago that I was in the military. Well, I'll start with saying one of the many blessings of having teaching dreams is spirit will show me somebody else's heart.

kind of like you sense fear in other people. Spirit will show me people's fears, insecurities, shame, a lot of shame. And so it's easier for me to understand others and not take things so personally. And also on the flip side, Spirit shows me myself. And in one dream not that long ago, through the...

The creativity spirit has is just endless. Spirit was showing me in a cooking contest where I was competing with other people to make a dish, a Mexican food dish. And without getting into the details of the dream, there was this point where the judge looked at me and said, kind of so that everybody else couldn't see it, she's like,

wink wink if you want to win the contest, you can use this ingredient. And I woke up and I was like, what the heck is that about? And it took me like many times spirits dreams, it takes me a week or two to figure out. I am just hooked up in the way kind of you are Mike, it's like, when there's a ladder of options.

hierarchy, so to say, of achievements, I just naturally think of the highest one. And so entering the military, I just naturally thought, I'll do 20 years. And I think a lot of people enter like, I'm just going to go all the way. It's just that achievement that's striving in us as humans. I entered because I was essentially homeless or out surfing.

at the time. And I really, really wanted my basic security and safety needs met so that I could get college, go to college. That's all I ever want to do is get like a PhD. And I figured that would all work out when I was in the military, go officer, whatever. But I joined because I needed food, water and shelter. And

It was amazing. My first duty station was an aircraft carrier. I happened to be the very first female on that aircraft carrier. October 1st of 1998, I stepped on board the USS George Washington, CBN 73 as an E3. And I had a rocky integration onto that ship. Some of the men didn't quite understand respecting women.

But I also had a lot of amazing mentors who took me under their wings and like instant uncles and father figures who taught me all kinds of things from personal finance, gave me books to read. Just they were just amazing leaders taught me follow ship and leadership. I made East. I was an ABE. So a aviation boats mate, equipment technician.

When you think of like Top Gun, the movie, it's the green shirts on the flight deck. They launch and recover aircraft off the catapults and arresting your system. So essentially a mechanic who gets illustrated by the staff in the tower on the flight deck, like a ballet. So you're just tightly timing for hours on end, in a, in a war zone, you're tightly timing, launching and recovering.

launching recovering and you're launching recovering four catapults off four catapults and two of those are the same place where the aircraft land. So it's kind of a beautiful mechanical orchestration. What year were you on the Washington? What year? Yeah, 98 to 03.

So we were on a deployment together. Wow. Yeah. 2000 or 2002? 2002. Wow. Yeah. And you were OS? What's that? You were an OS, right? IT. IT, OK. And I was on the USS Normandy, which we would command the planes after they left the George Washington flight deck.

Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. We're on a deployment together. You're just on a different boat. Yes. Yes. That's awesome. Yeah. Wow. That's crazy. So 2002. I'm trying to think what happened at the moment. Did we is that when the coal got bombed? coming back to the Suez. I don't.

I kind of remember, I think so. Yeah, that was my first deployment. I was not in a good headspace that first deployment. My second deployment, I was way more aware of what was going on. My first deployment was not, I was unaware of a lot of things going on. And so, but yeah, that's, as soon as you said Washington, I was like, and I later spent two weeks on the George Washington in 06, I was a...

I did the reserves for a year. And so I did my two weeks and I went to the Washington and spent two weeks there. So yeah, I know the ship well, well enough. She's a good one. She's a good one. That is so cool. So we've literally served together. Literally. Yes. That's amazing. You know, there's like a faint memory of your face.

And when you said that, I'm like, that's where where it comes from. That's interesting. Wow. Yeah, same place. Same time. Where was your office?

well, when I, the two weeks I was on the Washington. No, in 02. In 02, I was on the Normandy. but you never stepped on the GW? Not, not, no, no, no. Okay. Okay. Okay. Got it. So you were just in our, our carrier group then. That's right. That's right. Yeah. Wow. That is so rad. What a crazy coincidence. That's, that's, there's a lot of things going on in the military. The fact that we were like,

that close is interesting. Yeah, we probably saw each other in port calls and probably Liberty. Yeah. Wow. Yeah. Crazy. Yeah. So I interrupted you, but I had to explore that. Yeah, that's so I'm so grateful you shared that. That's super cool. I'm trying to think where it was. Okay. Yeah. So.

That's just bringing it all back. I'm getting hit by this like wave of nostalgia now. I can picture the P ways and so many C stories. Damn. Yeah, it's crazy. That's the whole part of my life. I don't think about much. Yeah, so I had a lot of guidance and I also was just, just built for achievement.

So I did well. I made E6 in three and a half years. I think the first female ABE to make E6, I applied for officer, got picked up for officer. Never went through the commissioning program for other reasons, but that was my plan. And then we were overseas and I was...

trying to get my finances in order. I had had a small like fender bender before I joined and I totaled a truck that I didn't have any insurance on and I really wanted to pay that money off and just get my credit score up and then save up money to buy a house, et cetera. So the carrot that they dangle through, you know, the re -enlistment bonus, all that stuff, that was very enticing for me.

And, you know, I didn't really, I wasn't really willing to take an honest look at my values. I struggled with I think, at least partially identifying as conscientious objector. For most of those years. I mean, 911 definitely changed me. It was the first time I really felt patriotic.

We were the aircraft carrier off the coast of New York City. that was a very surreal experience watching our crew, you know, the flight deck crew load ordinance onto aircraft that launched over our own land. And I could see the towers from the flight deck molding ground zero.

so I have some mixed feelings about my service and I, and I had mixed feelings at the time. I mean, I did it because I needed to take care of myself. but when I reenlisted at like four and a half years or four years, I reenlisted for six to get the bigger bonus. And that night I went to my rack, which was unusual because I.

rarely got to see my rack on deployment. Normally we would just sleep wherever. And I was nauseous. I was sick to my stomach. I knew I'd made the wrong decision. for me personally, I have so much respect for those who serve. but I had been reading books on the ethics of war for like a couple of weeks or months leading up to that decision. And I made the decision and then just,

Yeah, so I knew I needed to get out after my second term. So I had to wait six years. Wow. That was tough. That is tough. That's a six years of senioritis. Totally. And when I did get out, I was I was very clear. I have a lot of tolerance for risk. I tend to make big risky moves and

financially, just in terms of security. I don't know how many people, countless people came up to me and they were like, ABA 1 Daniels, you can't get out at 10 years. Like you've got, you're halfway there, dude. You've got half your paycheck for the rest of your life. And I'm like, that's not how I see it. I can't waste 10 years of my life being somewhere I know I shouldn't be.

And nothing's guaranteed anyway. Like, truly nothing's guaranteed. Except for death. I'm so grateful for those 10 years, but when I got out, my god, the day before I got out, some crusty E6 came up to me and he was like, hey Daniels, I know this is your last day, but we need you to stay on an overnight watch. I was on the Kennedy.

decommissioning the Kennedy and Jacksonville, Florida at the time on shore duty or access is technically suit sea duty. And, and I just looked at him and I was like, what you're going to put me overnight on the barge. My last day of 10 years in service, like with that two hour notice. And he was like, yeah, sorry, man, you know, blah, blah, blah. And I was like, you know, I was feeling nostalgic up until a moment ago. Now.

Yeah, yeah, I went straight from from 10 years after duty to grad school and never look back. What was what was that first day out like wake up a civilian? What was that?

I think just relief. I had PTSD dreams for a couple years that I was trapped of being trapped on that ship. I still have them from time to time. Like I can't get out either the ships going down or, you know, I, that was during the years of don't ask, don't tell. That was another thing, the psychological stress of I identified as bisexual at the time. I ended up writing my master's thesis on sexual fluidity in women.

under the age of 35 who identify as bisexual or unlabeled. And it's a part of my sexuality I never explored, but the fact that I couldn't explore it for 10 years, you know, knowing that, I mean, always having that fear that like I would be kicked out.

I didn't, there were a lot of things that made me feel like, yeah, just in the line, in the line, it was hard. So I don't remember the exact day after, but I'm sure it was really hard. And also grateful, you know? I mean, the military gave me all my leadership training that I took into corporate for 12 years after, gave me my GI bill, which I used to get my master's degree in psychology.

It gave me safety and security and three square meals a day and a roof over my head and an opportunity to pay off all that debt and buy startup series of buying properties. Like I, when I look back, Mike, I, I look at the people I grew up with. Nobody ever talked about college. I grew up lower middle income, barely and opportunities like that weren't even in our dreams.

And the military was the bridge from this kind of ghetto environment I grew up in to, you know, being retired at 43.

I have a lot of gratitude, but it was a sacrifice. So you spent 12 years in corporate after you got out and it sounds like that's ended now. Right. So what was that corporate life like? And it sounds like also you were experiencing a lot of, I guess, anxiety during those years as well. Yeah. Thanks for...

being in tune to that. Yeah, I got out I had been see I was 27 when I met my ex husband. We were together 16 years. His daughter was four at the time I met him, my daughter, I consider her my daughter, but Mason.

We raised her together. It was very kind of white picket fence, upper middle income, fast pace, fast dress, family vacation a few times a year, rat race. It's like, you know, 12 years I'd started after grad school. I got my degree in research psychology, not clinical psychology. So not the therapy route.

And I used, and I taught statistics at the university as a GTA. So I used that statistical background to enter the corporate world, starting with like big banks and doing a lot of data analysis around human behavior. And eventually kind of found my way in the corporate world from project management. Then I got into agile coaching, agile transformation coaching, and kind of finished it.

when I was 43. And at 43, due to a, at the time I would say, a set of fortunate circumstances.

But now I would say it probably was all just destiny. I ended up retiring, ran an Airbnb out of my house for a few years to make ends meet. Finally won the appeal on my application with the VA for disability for concussion on active duty. And that was enough for me to just completely stop the Airbnb. So I've been retired.

semi -retired since 43 and retired fully since 2009 or 2019. Nice. Nice. Is that when you started babbling with mushrooms? Yeah, about a year after a year or two of cautious interest in psychedelics. I was such a straight arrow my whole life. Entering that world took

time for me to warm up to it. Did it you? Did you have to or did you start early? Well, maybe middle of the road, but yeah, I'd been out for eight years. So I got an old five and the idea of I'm the oldest of five kids. So I was Mr. Responsible and

And you know, it was okay to drink.

but not do any other mind -altering substances. The thing that got me, put me over the edge, because I'm very research -oriented as well, is...

I had started hearing people like Tim Ferriss. I was a student of business and I was running my own business. I was running at the time I was running. I had two CrossFit gyms and I had a podcast and an online coaching business, fitness business.

And I was, I had begun investing and going to marketing conferences to learn about digital marketing. And I chose the right people to learn from because they were like subtly saying, Hey, this psychedelic stuff is probably helpful. and then listening to people. And if you're in the digital marketing, then everyone, if you're into that space, you know, Tim Ferriss is.

And he would go on Joe Rogan and say, yeah, I eat like a bag of mushrooms every six months to hit the reset button. And that that stuck in my head and I go, man, that guy's really smart. It's really successful. He's put together. And he's doing it. It can't be bad. I did a little bit of research and go, this stuff doesn't actually fry your brain. So I I went to a conference and then at the conference, I realized I'm supposed to eat mushrooms.

And I call my little brother up who I'm nine years older than him. And up until that point, I was like the judgmental. I had no empathy back then. So from like from the moment I went into the military to the age of around 30, I I was like, you know, alcohol was the only drug I was allowed to take. Maybe cocaine a couple of times in there. You know, you get too drunk and then someone gives you something.

But I didn't, I still was like, that's not a good thing to do, which I still agree. It's not a good thing to do. But I remember hitting at my brother and the, the relationship flipped because he was my hippie little brother. And I was like, Hey dude, I know you got some, I know you grow some mushrooms, so could you hook me up? And he was like, finally.

Finally, big brother is calling me for the mushrooms. I've been praying for this. And so, so I, I, I ate those and I got really lucky. I pulled off the set and setting perfectly without much research on that. Cause I was unaware that that was a thing and but still pulled it off nicely. Intuition was on point. Spirit was.

sending me messages, even if I was hard of hearing. And Empathy started coming online. And that was such a beautiful experience that I dove in a little more research just to confirm that it was OK. And I just started using them.

pretty frequently. I think I waited a month or two after my first time to kind of stabilize this new way of the expanded perspective that I was able to adopt. And I stabilized that and then started trying to reproduce the set and setting. And yeah, that was, so I was about 30. I was almost 31.

So not early, but also not late. I think that's actually a really good time in life to start exploring as someone who grows up in the Western world with the Western mind. I think that that's probably a good age. But, yeah. So not too early, not too late. But it was also 2013. So it was kind of like I was still early to the, not everyone was talking about it publicly in 2013 yet either.

So I was a little early in that sense. Yeah, you were, you weren't a hippie, but you were a in front of the wave for the Renaissance. Right. Yeah. Curious to know about the two months between your first time and your second time you describe it as like, kind of getting stabilized. But I think of that as like reorientating to a different way of

being in the world or seeing the world, which like, for me, part and parcel with spiritual awakenings and the mind kind of needing to expand and the heart opening. So when you say that you were doing that for two months, was that more integration work? Was that opening the mind and the heart? What was happening there for you?

It was practicing the empathy that I had learned. There were two really big takeaways in that experience. One was empathy and the other one was I realized that the entire world that I was experiencing was actually inside of me and that I was actually in charge.

of like once everything hit the sense space, I'm now in charge of everything that hits my eyes and ears and taste and all that is like, this perception that this is outside of me is an illusion. I'm I'm it was like I didn't have the words for the time, but I look back on it and I say that was a lesson in personal responsibility of.

this is this is my choices got me here. This is not the world isn't happening to me. I'm. Everything that I judge is negative is something due to my own thoughts, feelings, behaviors. And so I became one of the things that instantly hit me was going home after that and being.

way more inquisitive, more curious about other people and letting them talk and asking follow -up questions instead of just saying whatever I wanted to say next. So I remember going to bed that night because I did it in the early afternoon. I remember going to bed that night and I was so afraid that I was going to lose the effects of the the the effects of the mushrooms were going to wear off.

And I was no longer going to have this empathy that I was experiencing that day. And I woke up the next day and I still had the empathy. So I was super stoked about that. And I yeah, it was just such a big shift in my perception of reality that the desire to eat any more mushrooms wasn't there. It was more of like, I just want to explore this. I want to explore this.

practice empathy, bringing that with me in any moment. And then also the personal responsibility piece of like, like just a lot of analysis of my own life. I'm very...

analytical and introspective by nature. always had that online. And so sit, I was homeschooled all the way through. So there's a lot of sitting and thinking about things, without any one telling me what to think about. And so, I think there was a lot of just consideration going on. And then before I started back up, but that was,

That was my integration. And none of it was guided. I tell people all the time, I did it right. I had probably one of the best first time experiences and by the grace of God, by intuition, by all of it, pulled it off and put me in a really good position. And so I always encourage people, if you're gonna do it,

I suggest a guide because the guides are now way more available. In 2013, I couldn't find a guide in Memphis, Tennessee. There were no guides. In Memphis, Tennessee, there still may be no guides, but you can. You can find them now. They're available, I promise, if you look hard enough.

Wow, I loved your answer to that question. It really shows how thoughtful you are. There's so many things I'm curious about, but let me just sit with that for a second.

Yeah, it was your recognition that you were You wanted that empathy to stay stick around that heart connection to life And doesn't life effing suck and you don't feel it here. yeah Yeah, I'll drop there were there were many days where I didn't want to live before that it was

It's like, I'm achieving all this in fitness. I'm winning competitions or I'm competing at a high level. I'm running a business. I'm making a lot of money. Wow. I am so miserable in the mid in the midst of all the achievement. Still miserable. wow. Just connecting with another human being is way more satisfying than all that other stuff. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. It's not a heart connection, man. It's like.

feeling safe to be seen and being accepted for all we are even our quirky ugly human parts and like seeing the beauty in others, both the inspiring and their quirky ugly parts and having so much compassion for them and their struggles and that that human to human, human to earth, human to animal, nature, plant connection, man, that is what makes life sweet. For psychedelics.

You and I would not have the lives we have, the love that we have in our lives without them.

Yes, I can confidently say my life, if I were still alive, it would look very, very different. Very different. It took a pretty traumatic shift in a very positive way after that.

What I'm curious for you is what were the benefits that you got when you started using mushrooms? So you did your research and you were like almost sounds like you were reluctant to do them and then maybe and then yeah what was like the first experience like and what was the result?

I'm going to ask to pause so I can use the restroom.

it's so interesting that you ask about mushrooms. As you were asking that question, I was thinking. It's like, I'm sure a lot of people who work with plant medicine and who are listening to this can relate to this, but my life before ayahuasca and my life after ayahuasca are two different lives. And I would even include all my deep work with mushrooms in that before.

But when I first started working with mushrooms, I never considered doing it in a recreational way. I just wanted to heal. I wanted to learn. And so I started using five grams every time.

So for those who don't work with mushrooms, two to two and two to three is really if you have a potent medicine, it's plenty. And hero's dose is from five to 10. So it's on the lower end of like the big macro dose.

in those two years, well, my first and first time really sitting with mushrooms, I literally was being sucked into a black hole for like, two or three hours in complete terror, resisting a death that felt like everyone I ever loved and everything I ever loved was put

into a house on the second story. And I watched on from the street as the house was lit on fire and they were all burning today. That was my first mushroom trip. And you still went back for more. It took me a full year. I honestly, if that's part of what it's part of what broke me. It's just.

I didn't know it was possible to experience that kind of terror in the human experience. I'm going to interrupt real quick. Yeah. So five grams is a lot to start with, folks. It's a lot to start with. I don't recommend it for anybody. I don't care who they are. You're not starting with five grams. You heard my story. I start with two and a half.

of golden teachers, which is a little bit on the lighter end. That's a strain, by the way. So for for sunshine, she started five grams and had something that was with all these medicines. There's a relationship that gets built and you get to learn how to work with them. And so.

It could seem very overwhelming. So if you hear this story and go, well, shit, I don't want to have that experience. You don't have to have that experience. You can start lighter. And I'm sure there are some things that you would do differently now than you did then. Is that accurate?

I wouldn't change anything, but I would strongly recommend nobody ever do that the way I did. Right, right. No reason. I'm going to mention this now because I'll have it up before. I'm going to do a microdosing and a set and setting little free something on the website somewhere. So.

Anyone who's listening to this and maybe you if you have something please share but also I Am I've been getting hit with way? With a lot way too many questions to not put something together. So I'm gonna put something together soon where it's just like a quick resource on Do this not that Because I'm like you there's a lot of things I did that I don't regret doing but I would not suggest someone else do it that way

I mean, I think it touches on this archetype of martyr in a lot of us, which is maybe part ego and also part self -sacrificing. It's like a part of us that doesn't really value or takes immense risk, not usually appropriately. Yeah, that was the way I needed to learn.

But I will say, yeah, that five grams, I woke up the next morning, I was like, I'm never damn touching any psychedelic again in my life. And it really did bring up a whole bunch of, I was in a relationship at the time. So it brought up a lot of trauma. And I was very destabilized for a whole year. I started projecting onto that relationship.

all of my attachment wounds, which was anxious style at the time. I'm now secure, hard earned and proud of it. But it caused a lot of pain in that relationship. It caused...

I set up a weird relationship with parts of myself, which began like a pattern of me just taking huge risks that were unnecessary and caused a lot of suffering. When I say destabilized, like I was really destabilized. I was in an anxious state for like six months.

it also just, this first experience was also without a guide. Just want to confirm that. Okay. Right. Well, there was the person I was dating at the time was there and it didn't help it because as much as he cared about me, he was not equipped to deal with support and integration. And, and I wanted to go to sleep when I was being sucked into that black hole to protect myself.

And, you know, he didn't have the tools, but now I know if I was with a really experienced guide, they would have let me go to sleep because it would have been my subconscious protecting me from the terror. Every time I tried to go to sleep, he'd be like, Hey, hey, come back. no. Yeah. So it was just, let someone have their experience. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. So it was, it was really tough.

Actually, it was a podcast interview with Tim Ferriss who interviewed a woman who's you can no longer find it on the web anywhere, but she had an experience, a traumatic experience of being shot when she was a tourist overseas in Southeast Asia. And they found the guy that shot her and her friend. He died. And she sat with mushrooms and in her mushroom journey,

It's so amazing. I think of it as spirit, but we'll just say for the listeners, the spirit of mushrooms slowed down every second of her experience in that shooting to a frame by frame thing so she could see what she was thinking and feeling and she could process. So when I heard that podcast interview, I thought, wait, there's this thing called integration.

I mean, I was confused before I thought. And I did, I got to a point where I saw like the cosmic joke of my destabilizing experience and decided to set a ceremony again. And from that point on, I really journeyed for probably another year plus using the model of the Theosophical Society. Are you familiar with their work? I'm not.

So the Theosophical Society was early 1900s, I think, turn of the century in Europe. And they were a group of people, thought leaders that were tired of feeling oppressed by the institutions in Europe. So they took the religious institutions. So they took Far East paths to liberation like yoga and danta, Zen Buddhism.

And repackaged them for Westerners. And they called that the new thought movement. And actually that spread across the Atlantic and came over to the U S we call it new age movement. So the flavor spirituality that a lot of people practice here in Austin is a derivative of the far East that was repackaged by Europe. The philosophical society published this model of a pyramid, kind of like.

hierarchical states of consciousness and awareness in minerals, plants, animals, and humans. And I think it's six levels of awareness and that you could go up to Buddha nature, up to Christ consciousness. So I was really interested in this because it was mirroring some of the things I was experiencing myself.

and I didn't have the language to describe, so I started using terms like astral plane. I forget that there's a level above the astral, it'll probably come to me, but it's basically where the only thing that exists is thought, there's no form. So I started setting up experiments to get into higher levels of consciousness, and I got there.

I had a mushroom journey where literally I disappeared. And the only thing that was there was my mind. And I started looping saying, do I exist? And I thought, well, shit, if I say I am self -referencing, that answers the question. How do I ask the question? I didn't have a body.

I had no identity. I had no identity. So I explored, you know, for a while doing things like that. But a lot of the time I was working with mushrooms was at the heart level. I was asking, inviting friends and family into that space, which I just thought of as like the astral and started talking with them and trying to heal whatever wasn't harmonious in our relationship.

So my mom, the guy I was dating, my two best friends, and it was beautiful. And I feel like on some level, all of that healing actually happened. So by the time I came into the world of ayahuasca, I had already been practicing a lot of healing. The difference with mushrooms and ayahuasca for me is that ayahuasca talks back.

And so when I when I sit with ayahuasca And you touched on this earlier Mike there's like a teaching you had in your first ceremony, right? And it took you two months to kind of embody that empathy. Mm -hmm. So for me Once I go through Visuals with the visuals often tell me I'm entering into that spiritual place and then I'm in communion with spirit

and Spirit and I will start a dialogue and that dialogue will go on for some time like a river, like a long stretch of teachings and illustrations and healing and heart work and then there's a bend in the river and that's like time for me to rest, might be 10 minutes or 15 minutes and then a long stretch of dialogue and then a bend in the river as rest and that will happen for 8, 10, 12 hours.

That diet was sometimes 12 hours long. Mushrooms didn't feel like that. There was no presence there. There was no subject object. And ever since I've sat with ayahuasca, that presence is in every journey I do, whether it's cannabis, mushrooms. So for me, spirit is the teacher in all of them. They all feel the same way now.

If I go do a microdose of cannabis, I'm having a five -hour conversation spirit.

Yeah, yeah, I've had that experience too. After, after ayahuasca, everything, every plant, animal medicine I experienced after that shifted.

Yeah. What do you think presence is? Do you identify that presence as something? Spirit. Spirit, yeah. Yeah. I love the quote from Joan of Arc and I'm going to summarize it because I don't know the exact quote, but basically, you know, for those listening who aren't entrenched in work with plant medicines,

these experiences can be very destabilizing. And especially if you're not already spiritual. And Joan of Arc, you know, when I started hearing the voice of spirit, because I'm clear audience now, right? I can have conversations with spirit sober.

I'm trying to say. If you if you talk to god it's fine but if god talks back you're crazy.

And that's pretty much how we see it here in the West. You know, the role of the prophets and the mystics and the priests and priestesses were to connect us, the lay people to the divine. And if you weren't one of those in the society, then you were, you know, either ill or narcissistic. And these plants, if you work with them long enough,

you can develop a relationship and you start to have a connection with the divine. And at least I think of it as the divine. It's funny, one time I said to Spirit, Spirit, this is well into my journey because my awakening was a shamanic, classic shamanic awakening. It had all the textbook experiences of shamanic awakening. I do not identify as a shaman at all.

but literally psychosis, hearing voices, being struck by lightning.

All of those experiences happened in the first year and a half. You were struck by lightning? Yes.

Yes. I didn't experience it. I wouldn't believe it, but it happened. That happened. Were you harmed or? there, no, I mean, I couldn't bring my body temperature down for like five or six hours. It felt like the temperature was like 105. I literally could, I stripped my clothes off, took cold showers. I literally.

could not cool down. It's like I was in my heart. I thought my heart was gonna.

Like stop. It was so much electricity. It was, it was insane. But my point is my awakening happened to be a shamanic path. And I mean, I'm more interested in Buddhism today than, you know, I shouldn't say I'm more interested in Buddhism than shamanism, but my daily practice, spiritual practice is Buddhism, meditation. But my awakening, there was this moment where I said to spirit,

Spirit, am I talking with you? Or am I talking to the spirit of ayahuasca? Or am I talking to a human? Or a deity? Or something else? Because I really am comforted by the idea that I'm speaking to spirit, which I think of as like an intelligence in the field of everything. And it would be really...

sad for me to learn that it's not spirit and it's something lower but I want to know the truth like am I and the first first time I asked that I went to sleep that night and in my dreams spirit said

Consciousness is not here, conscious is not there, conscious is everywhere.

And I wasn't satisfied, so months later I asked the question again. And in my dreams that night, Spirit said, Spirit is in everything.

So since that I've just called it spirit. You know, it's the mind that divides things. The, this makes me think of a couple things. One is, you know, people who work with ayahuasca, they refer to ayahuasca as like grandmother or mother ayahuasca. And my experience with that is, she's called that because.

She teaches you how to work with everything else. It's like once you go to her, you were talking about how all your experiences had shifted, like your experience with mushrooms had shifted and cannabis had shifted and the frequency of each one of those medicines, spirit can speak through those. But I'm with you. Spirit is everywhere all the time in all things. And

and everything has its own frequency. So we're getting spirit speaking to us through different frequencies. And I've done some work with some Native Americans as well. And there's a lot of animal totems that are used in like, the coyote came and visited me or the bear or the snake or one of these animal totems. And they all

they all have a message from spirit through their own frequency is the way I see it. And the same with people is everyone has something to teach me and it's God speaking through them and it's their frequency that it's coming through. So I'm with you on that. That's how I perceive how that's working, the best I can put into words.

It's such a fun topic because in South America, we'll just say the Amazon because we know that best.

they refer to different spirits, right? And they don't often say like they're equivalent to God or a supreme creator. They kind of just talk about different spirits, grandfather spirits, grandmother spirits. If you talk with them about the kineha, the geometric forms that are woven into their textiles, their earrings, they will say,

That is, that's the song, the Ikro that they're singing, which I think of a spirit, right? That Ikro. But if you earn their trust more, they will say, the Keneah is a map to the jungle. So it helps the Jaguar find its prey. And you're like, what? It's a map to the jungle? And then if you hang out with them longer, they'll say, well, it's a map to the universe.

and I came out of ceremony in September, walked out of the mocha to use the restroom and, wow, my battery is low. I may have to pivot to charge my battery. But,

I'm, I don't know why most of my profound conversations happen on a toilet with ayahuasca, but I'm really in this tiny little bathroom. It's under the moonlight. It's dark out, you know, the, the, the Maloka has that really strong force in it of medicine and, and there's this toilet and a, and a sink and then a candle on the floor. And I noticed there are these pill bugs walking.

around the candle being attracted to the light. And I'm really in the strong force of medicine. So I kind of close my eyes, do my business. I'm still on the toilet and I realize as I open my eyes, that those geometric patterns show up on the tile of the bathroom in pink and purple and start to spread against the wall. And it was vibrant, like neon colors. It was so beautiful. And Spirit said,

I am always here, you just don't always see me.

And then one of the pill bugs, the biggest one, which is like a grandfather, he starts walking towards me and I'm like, whoa, dude, I'm super high right now, like give me some space. And he's like, do do do do do do do do do do. And I was like, grandaddy, boundaries, like can you, can you, And then he's not stopping, so I'm like, okay, ground, find my breath, breathe. And I open my eyes and I see this iridescent force field shape.

go over this granddaddy pill bug and I'm like, whoa. And then I look and all the pill bugs, like this force field over them and spirit, this is so cool, Mike. I don't even know how to describe this. Spirit let me feel energetically what that force field was. It was like a hypnosis and it was the same intelligence as the spirit.

of ayahuasca in the Maloka. And I was like, damn, everything in the universe has that intelligence. So they, that's how they relate to, you know, God down there. And in, in, you know, Hinduism, they would say the Brahmins. I mean, Brahman, right, is the unified field of intelligence. And we have so many words to describe the unnameable, but literally in,

the ayahuasca ceremony two weekends ago, I'm laying outside of the maloka just looking up at the stars and everything takes this rainbow geometric patterns of like small geometric patterns, octagons, like breathing the stars, the trees, the grass. This guy walks by, he's got them. And Spirit said, I am, the universe is intelligent.

That's how you can communicate with me and I can communicate with you. And in Buddhism, just to kind of round it out, Buddhist, depending on kind of your school of Buddhism, you know, enlightenment experiences of unity is seeing that our true nature is that all form is actually just spirit.

It's the mind that divides form into form, but it's literally just spirit moving through everything.

Yeah. Yeah.

everywhere. I had a friend ask me, he was, he's asking me about if I believe in God. And I was like, no, I know God. And for a moment there, he was like, man, my buddy's an atheist. I was like, no, no.

Yeah. And yeah, I did not believe in God until I did ayahuasca. The mushrooms and some other substances I had done before and I was like, these are great enhancing tools that give me access to different parts of myself. And then ayahuasca opened that door and I go, got it. And that was, that was the beginning of that journey. So I follow you. Yeah.

It's amazing. It's amazing. Is there anything you want to share before we go? Anything that.

just burning for you. The only thing in my battery may die, so it might be perfect timing here. Six percent. So I apologize, but it's actually great. I think the only thing on my heart left to say is that for those veterans out there.

We're struggling with severe anxiety and depression.

and a sense of disconnection and probably crippling loneliness and feeling stuck. There's definitely a lot of, there are definitely a lot of resources out there for improving our mental health. And I am annoyingly,

strong at advocating for meditation. Any type of mindfulness practice, learning how to connect with the body and witness the mind, drop into the heart space and slowly let the heart open to feel all the feelings that we all stuff down, that come up in graceful and compassionate ways for reconnecting.

and getting out of the head and into the heart. And if you're listening to this and you're just feeling alone, yeah, reach out. Because the resources are out there.

There's no reason to suffer alone. Beautiful. Thank you for joining us today. Thanks for the conversation. Of course. Is there a website, social media accounts that people can find you? Thank you for asking. Beddingon .love. There's no dot com. It's just dot love. Beddingon .love is the best place for my YouTube channel.

sunshine underscore grace Starting the dialogue about these topics. So join the conversation. I'd love to meet you Excellent. Thank you so much for sharing your wisdom Thank you so much for sharing the platform in your heart and your mind. It's a pleasure to get to know you brother, of course

Mike Bledsoe (1:36:24)
Thank you for tuning into this episode of the Mission After. Before we wrap up, I want to remind you about our free resource, the 10 surprising military habits that are sabotaging your career and your life. This guide is packed with valuable insights to help you overcome common challenges faced by veterans transitioning to civilian life. Don't miss out on this opportunity to take control of your career and life. Head over to the missionafter .org to download your copy now. It's completely free and could be the game changer you're looking for.

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